FRANK CARSON et al 12-14-2017

THE WITNESS DID SHOW UP TODAY

by Marty Carlson

12-14-2017


The morning session got a late start as was scheduled for 9:30 AM, the judge was there around 9:20 AM, but we are waiting for Marlisa Ferreira who claimed she had another case in another courtroom and got hung up. Court will find it was started around 10:20 AM.

Initially there was scheduled a Pitchess motion for today but that’s been postponed until December 19 at 9:30 AM.

Immediately they put Kim Stout back on the stand to continue with questioning from Jai Gohel. Repeating that she had known Korey Kaufman all his life, and usually saw him on a daily basis. She was friends with the Pickett family, and you like keys. The police had come to her about two years later to get her statement, she did not go to them.

Percy Martinez started asking questions about the last day that she saw Korey Kaufman walking in the car passed her by. She stated that was not the last day that was two days before the last day that she saw Korey on Johnson after the car went by. She said the car stopped at Kevin Pickett’s house, about four houses down from the corner. She was sure that neither one of the Atwals brothers were not in the car, and had told Kurt Bunche that. She did not recall if she had told Kirk Bunch if she had seen either at wall brothers in the car any time that day.

She also stated that she told Kirk Bunch that Michael Cooley had been upset with Korey, but not sure why. She also noted that she told the investigators that she was on Linwood then turned down Johnson and was on that street when the threats were made.

She also noted that Korey Kauffman had talked about prior to her conversation with law enforcement, Korey had talked about my Cooley and another piece of ship person that were upset with Korey prior to the threats by Robert Woody. When asked by Kirk Bunch what did Korey have to say she stated that Korey said that he wasn’t worried about it and that Korey was calm. She stated he was calm about the threats but appeared agitated.

Mdm. Dist. Atty. began her redirect and Kim Stout said Korey was not acting any different than any other time but was upset. She stated that Korey was not one to get enraged. She stated at the time of the threat Korey had said just deal with it now not later. She said his voice was normal, and Robert Woody said you heard what I said, and she had talked to Cory about one minute later. She stated Korey said those motherfuckers from pop and cork keep accusing me of taking property on ninth Street, now they’re coming to my house.

Attorney Hans inquired about the March 11, 2014 interview with Kirk Bunch and the car that she was in with investigators at Johnson and Linwood. She said that Korey was walking southbound on Johnson and that’s when their paths crossed that she was walking northbound. She pointed out to Kirk Bunch a telephone pole where she noted she first saw the car, and then a second pole as she walked down the street and met up with Korey. In the car was northbound on Johnson.

At that point questioning if Kim Stout was done and she was dismissed from the courtroom.

Attorney Hans called Kirk Bunch to the stand to discuss the March 11, 2014 interview with Kim Stout. Asking specifics of the meeting between Kim Stout in Korey Kauffman on Johnson and Linwood. The address of the pole they discovered was 1433 S. Johnson and they met at the by another pole she pointed out that was at 1307 S. Johnson. Korey Kauffman resided at 1125 S. Johnson. When asked if he had determined the distance between the addresses Kirk but stated he did not know nor did he look it up. When asked what application he used on his phone to determine distances he says Google maps is usually very reliable. At this time attorney Hans asked Kirk Bunch to open his app on his phone to measure the distances.

When asked for an offer of proof by the DA attorney Hans stated that Kim Stout said that on March 11, 2014 statement she was not close enough to hear what was said between the car and Korey, and the distances are significant as to now claiming being close enough to hear. Kirk Bunch uses Google maps and is accurate and he says he has use it before for these purposes.

Kirk Bunch opened Google maps on his phone and the distance between the two addresses was 1/10 of a mile and two minutes walking time.

Jai Gohel argued to the court there is no mention by Kim Stout that she had heard what was said from the car previously. Kirk Bunch report said Korey told her there was threats, but Kim Stout also said that Korey was calm. In the first time that anyone had heard Kim Stout say she heard threats was today in court.

Mme. DA asked how they learned of Kim Stout’s information through Kevin Pickett. He had given contact information to law enforcement. Kevin Pickett never said why Kim Stout wanted to talk to investigators. She said that she saw Korey talking to the people in the car and he stated those motherfuckers have been threatening me, all because of my Cooley. Korey Kauffman thought they were talking to him because of all the thefts that my Cooley had done.

Kim Stout told Kirk Bunch about the neighbor by the name of Paden, and Kim Stout said that they had threatened to kill Korey. She also said that she had no bad feelings for the pop and cork people. Looking up the distances on the application was two minutes, and Kim Stout said it was three minutes, so her story was consistent. Kim Stout saw the car in front of the house then drive by her. He also said that Robert Woody whistled at her as they went by and nothing else was said.

She stated that Kim Stout was excited when relaying the story to investigators, and Korey Coppin was still talking about the threats two days later when she walked to the recyclers with him.

Percy Martinez asked Kirk Bunch asked Kim Stout if she was there when the threat was made, and she said no. She said she never heard anything other than what Korey had told her.

Now final arguments were going to be heard in attorney Hans started out as it was his motion.

He said that Kim Stout statements from Korey, in the report, are different than what she is saying now on the stand. She now says she heard the comments and originally that’s not what she told investigators. She stated that Korey’s statements were 3 to 4 minutes after the incident and Korey did not appear excited or was saying any type of spontaneous statements. He also said Kim Stout’s testimony was very vague talking about the different days and seeing Korey and they seem to get a little mixed up.

He stated there is no hearsay exception on all statements made on either day. The testimony she gave in court was completely different than the statement that she gave to Kirk Bunch. They had walked 300 to 400 feet before meeting up with Korey. She said yesterday that she was 10 to 12 feet away from Korey when the threats were made. There are many differences in her statement and testimony. Under 352 the judge can use discretion. He also noted that the neighbor Paden was there hearing the comments your asses grass and then the car left.

Robert Woody said it was Bobby Atwal, but Kim Stout says it was a relative and not him. What this witness has been saying is not possible as she says she was there yesterday on the stand. Yesterday she was changing stories and seemed confused. It’s physically impossible for her to hear the conversation. He asked that the statement be excluded.

Percy Martinez argued for the court to allow this type of testimony requires trustworthy and reliability aspect to it. Kirk Bunch had probed Kim Stout extensively and she never said what she is saying in court. Kirk Bunch was probing what she saw and is not what she said in court. He was also trying to find out what Korey state of mind was an Kim Stout said he wasn’t worried about it and appeared calm. Korey was more concerned about my Cooley’s activities and keeping his threats and activities going.

Mme. DA argued and started reading from the evidence code under 1240, saying Korey Kauffman statements were made under the stress of excitement. Kim Stout described Korey as irritated and upset and agitated. This was caused by the event based on what he said. He tells Kim Stout they threatened to kill him if he didn’t stay off the property. Kim Stout was walking down the street, and someone was yelling out the window so loud that she could hear.

Now reading from Justice Simon’s evidence code she stated that’s exactly what happened that she quoted in the code and the excited utterance exception. She stated simply being calm does not mean it is not an excited utterance. This is a critical stage leading up to the disappearance of Korey. Kim Stout says she heard the threat and it is cooperated by other witnesses like Robert Woody.

Attorney Hans argued again the DA is arguing a little bit different argument now with the time frames, and Kim Stout now testified she was 10 feet away. The neighbor Paden testify he did not see anyone in the passenger side of the car. He said the district attorney kept saying there is cooperation by others, but Robert Woody kept denying he was on Johnson Street until investigators repeatedly insisted that he was.

Then Robert Woody had said Bobby Atwal but now Kim Stout is saying it was not Bobby Atwal but a relative. This was not cooperated by Robert Woody or anyone else. Robert Woody only wore down after investigators insisted. Kim Stout was too far away to hear, clearly not a spontaneous statement.

Percy Martinez argued there must be some occurrence to create an excited utterance. Kim Stout said Korey did not take the threat seriously and was not worried. It was just an idle threat. He argued that everything that Kim Stout said in 2014 does not show an excited utterance.

Judge Zuniga finally started to rule and saying she’d been reading this information regularly recently, and disagree that the testimony was confusing. She stated the questions were not clear to this witness.

I noticed that this time judge Zuniga had kind of a puzzled look on her face and it did not seem that she was clear what she wanted to do.

She noted that the witnesses in this case are not articulate, and Kim Stout describing Korey Kauffman’s demeanor was different than what many people would say. It is the declared state of mind of Korey and she said Kim Stout was consistent in what she said about Korey to allow her to testify, but was not allowed to testify about Friday’s statements about what Korey had said.

Court was done for the day, only working half a day to day to return at 9:00am tomorrow

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