LAST NIGHTS PODCAST TRANSCRIBED
Good evening everybody, this is Marty from Dawg’s blog with tonight podcast on January 10, 2019 for the Frank Carson et al trial. In the afternoon session Robert Woody was still on the stand and Marlisa Ferreira was still doing direct. The jury was up around 1:34 PM. The Judge was on the bench at 1:36 PM. We did pretty good this afternoon, as we did this morning, actually we didn’t do too bad, comparatively speaking.
Marlisa Ferreira picked up where she left off. As they finished the morning session, they were talking about getting ready go up to the mountains and supposedly they took Korey Kauffman’s body up to the mountains and dumped him up the mountains. Robert Woody talked about Baljit Athwal drove the truck up to the mountains and got out of the truck when he got up there.
Remember Robin Attenhoffer was in the car with him. They were loading the body up into the truck and she walked up from his house and noticed what was going on and went with them.
They went down an embankment to a wooded area. the tarp was still around Korey Kauffman, they never removed the tarp. they rolled the body out of the tarp into an area, he said it was a little bit away from the road. he said there was no discussions. they didn’t talk about anything. he just kind of followed Bobby Athwal’s lead.
Remember Robert Woody cut the fingers and the toes off because he said the fingers and the toes have the same fingerprints. The toe prints and fingerprints are the same, this is what Robert Woody thinks. that’s why he cut the fingers and toes off of the body so it couldn’t be identified. Well then when they roll the body out of the tarp, up in Mariposa County and he throws the fingers and the toes around when they left the body. so he cut them off so they wouldn’t be identified as Korey Kauffman, and then he leaves of the fingers and toes up there with the body.
Then he rolled up the tarp and with the knife that he used (the knife that he originally put in the tarp with the body in the hole in the grave at Pop and Cork) and threw the tarp back in the bed of the pickup truck. the body was not covered. He was left on top the ground. there were rags he had used when he cut the digits off the remains and he said those rags were also rolled up in the tarp. there was no conversation on the way back from Mariposa County. he said there were no cars on the road or very few cars on the road. it was late at night. there were no stops that were made on the way back. they went straight to Pop and Cork. they arrived about two or 2:30 AM and the store was closed and Daljit was at the store.
He put the tarp and the contents in the side lot and the next day he burned the rags and the knife. he says “he didn’t know why” and he put the tarp in the dumpster. So, he wanted to burn everything to get rid of that the evidence but then just throws the tarp that had the remains in a dumpster. Korey Kaufman’s socks were with the rags in the tarp. he said the body was dumped probably 30 or 40 yards the road. the area was cluttered with, he said, live trees, dead trees, different foliage and stuff in the area. When they got back to store—
Now, I’m taking the notes as the questions are being asked and it jumps around. You might notice we get on a certain area and then it jumps to another area and then they go back to the first area later on. this is a tactic that they use. it doesn’t keep a regular flow for the jury and maybe that’s the point, I don’t know.
So when they got back to store he talked to Daljit and Baljit and he was making it sound like it was a mutual decision to get rid of the truck, for any DNA evidence that might’ve been left in the bed of the truck. now according to Robert Woody, they killed Korey Kauffman over on the property and transported the dead body with nothing on the top or underneath in the bed of the truck, and they didn’t need to destroy any evidence, but when they moved the remains 20 days later, they needed to destroy the evidence then. I guess I really don’t understand the mentality here, but that’s what he is saying. They didn’t need to destroy the evidence when the killing occurred but did need to when they moved the body three weeks later. He said he got the key from Bobby Athwal. he drove the truck into an orchard and used one the gas cans that was in the side lot shed with the weed eater and lawn mower. he left Pop and Cork with the gas cans. he went out E St. Daljit Athwal, he said, followed him out E St. where he said it dead ended. I don’t think he realized that, but he was actually in Merced County at that point, if I remember right. he doused it with gas, he lit a cigarette and enclosed it. Remember that he had said he used a match in the preliminary hearing. he said he used to match to light the gas in the gas can. Well, it doesn’t really work that way, is not that simple. if you pour the gas out and light the gas maybe that would work. but in a gas can there’s needs to be more oxygen. What he’s now saying was he took a cigarette and he put the lit cigarette in a book of matches. It’s like a fuse. He let the cigarette burn down to the matches and then it flames up. He doused the cab with gas so it’s gonna fire up. he said Robin Attenhoffer had gotten into Daljit Athwal’s car, the BMW. all this occurred around 2:40 AM. Again he used a cigarette as a fuse. he did not recall if Robin Attenhoffer had her phone or he had her phone or if she had even brought her phone. He said Daljit Athwal did use his phone to videotape the burning truck. after one or two minutes of watching the truck burn they went back west on E St. back into town.
He had given Bobby Athwal the truck key back. again, that’s not what he said in the preliminary hearing. my recollection is that he said he wanted to make it seem unique and real and he hotwired the truck. They’re saying with the key fob he can’t do that. well it happens every day even with brand-new trucks with the technology that’s out there. Around 3:15 AM he was back at the store and he said to Bobby Athwal will make report of the stolen truck in the morning.
This led up to a sidebar at that point, requested by Judge Zuniga. Marlisa Ferreira asked a couple more questions and it led immediately to another sidebar. I really don’t know what to what that was all about. The Judge wasn’t too happy with something and remember there were constant objections of these leading questions that Marlisa Ferreira keeps asking.
Robert Woody also said that Baljit Athwal took the floor mats and jack out of the truck and miscellaneous papers but left a bunch of stuff in there. he said Robin Attenhoffer was with him when Baljit was removing the items in the truck. once there was talk of the burning the truck again…this led to another sidebar. there are some issues there that the Judge is not happy with. I’m not really clear on what these issues are and they don’t clarify them, especially with the jury in the room.
So, after talking about Korey Kauffman, Daljit Athwal took Bobby Athwal home. he said no one else showed up at the store during that time. he went home and when he got home it was Robin, his mom’s, his dad’s, his sister and all the others were there. they had a large number of people living in in that house. he said he did not tell anyone what was just done. he was asked about that Frank Carson representing him on his possession of stolen property beef, which I believe was an auto theft that was done by his brother, but he was there with his brother. He had found out in court that the case had been dismissed and apparently that was this he said that was the same day that they Frank Carson had talked to him about Mike Cooley and the thefts on his property. they had gone to Mike Cooley’s house, where some of the threats were made to supposedly, and they went to Pop and Cork and he was with Baljit that day. Baljit told Daljit about the Cooley visit and what was said and what happened at the Cooley’s house. they were talking about the theft issues going on at the Frank Carson property and Cooley probably being in large part responsible.
Around 2:15 PM the jury was sent out. the judge had a question because Marlisa Ferreira’s gone into these conversations that the Atwal’s are having. The judge wants to know if he’s really knows what’s being said or if he’s in a narrative because are they talking Punjabi or are they talking English? The Judge is asking Marlisa Ferreira and then she asked Woody too. He said some of it was English and some of it was in Punjabi, so he had a good idea of what was being said. Judge Zuniga advised the Marlisa Ferreira to clarify what language these conversations were occurring. It was less than five minutes and the jury was back in. Marlisa Ferreira continued her direct examinations.
Robert Woody said the Atwals were discussing the Korey Kaufman thefts in English and Bobby Athwal, he said, was talking about the thefts in Frank Carson’s property. Daljit Athwal was saying about how they needed to be stopped. Daljit Athwal was talking about Mike Cooley and in his role in the thefts. Woody said they were talking about maybe assaulting Mike Cooley or something to stop the thefts.
Robert Woody also said he continued to work at the store after he burned the truck and he had worked there for almost 2 years after. he was aware that Kevin Pickett had come by the store after Korey Kauffman had gone missing. Robert Woody was present when Kevin Pickett came in and he had asked the Athwal’s to post flyers on the front door going into Pop and Cork.
Again went to another sidebar. there is an issue that the Judge is concerned about and I’m not totally 100% what that issue is.
He said Kevin Pickett and the Athwal’s had no conversation about Korey Kaufman or anything else after the flyer was posted. So just that one day when the flyers were put up by Kevin Pickett, after that there were no conversations with Kevin Pickett that he was aware of. The flyer was on the glass doors for an unknown amount of time. Kevin Pickett explained it was a missing person, a relative of his. Athwal’s had told Robert Woody to stay quiet in regard to Korey Kauffman after the flyers. Remember this is what Woody is saying and he’s staying very close to where Marlisa Ferreira wants his testimony to go. Kevin Pickett had come in about one week after Korey Kauffman went missing. Korey Kauffman, he said, was still buried in the side lot when Kevin Pickett came in. Marlisa Ferreira was asking some questions and I didn’t really quite understand what she was asking, and Robert Woody started looking very confused up on the stand. apparently, she finally got him to do say that the CHP’s–meaning Wells, McFarland and Quintanar– and the Atwal’s were talking about the flyers and just talking in general about Korey Kauffman. Scott McFarland was talking about a seeing Korey Kauffman around town. The Athwal’s were trying to help the family look for him. Scott McFarland, remember, has claimed that he saw Korey Kauffman on April 1 riding his bike down the street when he was out irrigating his fields or whatever he was doing. Woody is saying that McFarland said he saw Korey Kauffman, so I don’t know. Marlisa Ferreira asked him if he if he saw any guns at the store that have laser sights? he said there was like a mini 14 assault type of rifle that had laser sights, it was mounted on the top that Daljit Athwal had owned. he did not recall seeing that gun with the laser sights prior to the homicide. he said Daljit and Quintanar were talking about the laser on the gun, this was after, I guess, Korey Kauffman went missing, is what I understood.
Marlisa Ferreira asked him if he ever met Steve Duden (one of the first witnesses in this case, he is a private investigator that was hired by Frank Carson and Marlisa Ferreira didn’t like his answers and immediately tried to impeach him). he didn’t recall talking to Steve Duden, but he did talk to Frank Carson’s private investigators when they came to the store. there were two private investigators he said came to store and then he said it was Jon Evers and Kurt Bunch who showed up at the same time. In actuality I believe it was Cory Brown and Frank Navarro, but I’m not sure, I think one of them was Cory Brown, but it could’ve been Jon Evers. The private investigators came around after the search warrants were done on all the properties. he was asked if Frank Carson’s private investigators say why they wanted to interview him? Baljit Athwal had called him to the store to talk to the investigators. he was at home and Baljit had called him on Robin Attenhoffer’s phone. they didn’t have a house phone. they want to talk to them about the thefts and the damage that law enforcement had done during a search warrant, especially to Pop and Cork. he was called to the front of the store. he said it was Jon Evers and Kurt Bunch, I don’t think it was those two, but it could’ve been. with all the investigators there, two private investigators, one sheriff’s investigator and one a task force investigator, they all met the store at the same time with Baljit Athwal and Robert Woody. The investigators were not getting along too well, trying to figure out what each other was doing and Robert Woody was sent home and he said he never talked to anybody that day.
During Frank Carson’s representation he was asked if he heard about trackers that were being used under the cars? he said Quentinar told Daljit Athwal to have Robert Woody (they call Robert Woody 5-0, for whatever reason) for and told Daljit to have Robert Woody or 5-0 look under the car. Daljit Athwal felt that he was being followed and Robert Woody did look under the cars and nothing was found. he was asked if Quentinar said anything about trackers? he didn’t recall. This tracker, he said, was discussed prior to the homicide, so that didn’t make sense so maybe I misunderstood something there. He also said he never heard talk by anyone about any type of baiting that was done at the property to lure thieves in, to try to catch them. Marlisa Ferreira didn’t specifically say the pipes but that’s what she was getting at. He did not recall anybody else being on the property on the night that Korey Kauffman was caught.
The jury was sent out for break on at 2:58 PM. we took a take a 20-minute break and Judge Zuniga noted to Marlisa Ferreira that there were some questions she asked in regard to some barbed wire and other things on the property that need to be clarified, that somebody was trying to booby-trap the fence on the back property.
After the break the Judge was talking to Marlisa Ferreira about Robin Attenhoffer telling others what happened. She wanted Woody to testify about who Robin Attenhoffer told and what she told them. Marlisa Ferreira is not going to ask who she talked to and what was said, but that that’s where the question was leading to and the judge didn’t want it to go any farther than that. this is before the jury was brought into the courtroom. Marlisa Ferreira also argued that Robert Woody did all these horrible acts due to fear of the Athwals and he goes to his credibility and the believability of his testimony, so she wants to go into some of these areas like Robin Attenhoffer’s comments other people, but it’s all hearsay and really can’t be done.
Jai Gohel argued that Robert Woody’s state of mind is not relevant. saying that he was fearful of the Athwals and scared to go against them. he worked for Pop and Cork for several years and he wanted to be there. he worked for several years after all this happened, so he is saying it’s not relevant.
Attorney Hans argued that Marlisa saying why do these things why do these things, but Robert Woody took it upon himself and that’s what he said. Robert Woody testified that he decided to cut the fingers and the toes off, he decided to do some the things on his own, he wasn’t directed by anybody else. Hans says that his state a mind is not relevant. Marlisa Ferreira says it’s up to the jury decide, but state of mind goes to all witness’ involved and goes to their believability. Hans argued, to argue that now, in fear of the Athwals is just not flowing, it is not a proper way to do it.
Judge Zuniga noted that Robert Woody has said that he felt obligated and Robert Woody’s state of mind is in dispute and unknown what he will say. she says the objection is overruled, but she’s being very cautious about what’s going on here.
Jai Gohel also raised another objection, I think this is where some of those sidebars came from, there is an ongoing problem with Marlisa Ferreira leading witnesses in court, this is what Jai Gohel said and I agree with him. Marlisa Ferreira asks the question that is a leading question that gives him the answer, it is objected to and she asks the question properly, but now he already has the answer.Basically Jai Gohel says she’s testifying, she’s not doing a direct examination, he says on the extent that that’s being done is ongoing issue and it rises to the level of misconduct.
Marlisa Ferreira said the defense’s argument on this stuff is an ongoing thing it’s not on point and Robert Woody is not a good witness and a problem getting answers out of him and she is allowed to ask leading questions. The Judge kind of says, oh no you don’t, and the judge interrupted and says the problem is not with Robert Woody, it’s with the district attorney’s inabilities to not get the questions out properly to get the answers that she wants. She also noted that no one in this entire courthouse is ever put a stop to this bad habit that she has. Marlisa Ferreira took exception to this as she always does, and she started getting pissy and was bouncing in her seat a bit. Judge Zuniga said that she has a bad habit of leading and this has got to come to a stop. Marlisa Ferreira’s says to the Judge, well the record speaks for itself. the judge says it sure does. Marlisa Ferreira didn’t want to accept what was going on there, she wanted to do it her way.
We got the jury back in about 3:42 PM. Robert Woody’s back on the stand. She asked him again about returning to the house after the homicide? He said he felt sick and scared of what had just happened, especially when he decided to cut the fingers and the toes off, Korey Kauffman getting shot scared him and mentally that feeling has lasted a long time. he said he still feels that way now. he says that since his arrest he has had a couple conversations with the Athwals, when his dad was working at the store, he had called his dad on his dad’s phone and he talked the Athwals and Bobby Athwal said they would put money on his books and just told him to stay quiet. Yes, they did put some money on his books, and he did apparently several times while he was in custody. there were just one or two conversations apparently, the way I understood it, with Baljit or Daljit and it was mostly about money on the books and things like that. he was asked if he used Robin Attenhoffer’s phone while he was working at the store. he said no, she had that, it’s just that they used her phone number to call over there to get a hold of him to come to the store and come to work. they had no house phone in the residence. he had received some love letters, as did the Athwals, in regard to wiretaps. They had been caught on wiretaps that were intended for somebody else, they call them love letters.
Around 3:55PM, there was a sidebar. the jury was sent out. by the way, the jury’s not coming back until Tuesday at 10 AM. Woody was also sent out. tomorrow they’re having a motion day and doing two or three motions, they don’t expect it to be longer than half a day tomorrow, but you know how those things go. Judge again is telling Marlisa Ferreira about her leading questions and Jai Gohel’s objection about giving answers in her question and that she says in essence she is testifing and that she did it again when she asked about the wiretap love letters. Percy Martinez argued to the court that they had just talked about these leading questions and had that conversation before the jury was brought in after the break and she immediately goes back and asked another question exactly the same way and he says something’s gotta be done to stop this. Judge Zuniga again was looking very confused, as she doesn’t know what to do, that common look that she’s gets. Marlisa Ferreira’s again to start the bounce in her seat and she says the question was about what happened to a phone after he got the letter. so Marlisa Ferreira asked him what happened to Baljit Athwal’s phone after he got that love letter, so she was telling him something happened to that phone instead of asking if something did happen or what if anything happened at all. she’s testifying and that’s what the defense is arguing. she says the defense objections are not valid, not supported by the evidence code, and so on. Marlisa Ferreira then goes into her attack mode, as she typically does in these types of things and she accuses the defense of being obstructionist of the Robert Woody testimony by making these arguments. This is what she does she gets caught in things and she goes on the attack and that’s what she did did again.
Judge Zuniga started reading from Justice Simons book on evidence and about leading questions and she quoted the book and she said the way the Marlisa Ferreira asked the question, led Woody to believe that something had occurred after they got those love letters and it led him to think that there’s something else that needed to be said there. She wasn’t trying to get information from him, she is giving information to him. I don’t know if anything can be done about it or not. The defense is getting extremely frustrated with this type of questioning. there doesn’t seem to be any downside to it being done by the DA in this case because nothing is done about it. I don’t know if anything can be done about it be honest with you.
So that’s where we left off. We are back tomorrow at 9:30AM. We are doing the motions, probably just the morning session and we’ll probably just have a noon report. Don’t forget my PayPal buttons at the bottom of each report, my sponsors Merced Tile Supply a very good sponsor, good people down there, they have good stuff going on.
So, don’t take my word for it come to court find out for yourself. Good Night Everybody!