Good evening everybody. This is Marty from DAWG’s Blog with tonight’s podcast on Tuesday, June 4, 2019. This is in regards to the Frank Carson et al. Trial. No jury today. They were originally scheduled for 1:30 PM and they were cancelled. I think some things were done that will step up the pace of finishing this trial – believe it or not!
There was a witness here this afternoon, actually a couple of them. William Hippilito, from Valley Auto Wreckers, a tow truck driver who was driving the flatbed who hauled the cars off Walter Wells Sr. property after he had passed away. Marlisa Ferreira said he was brought in to impeach Lt. Commander Patrick Emery. The gentleman was not pleased about being here in the first place and they ordered him back. I think he’s pretty much a one-horse operation from the way it sounded. They ordered him back Thursday at 9 AM. Joe Lima and his wife ordered back tomorrow at 9 AM, along with David McMillan’s wife.
Judge Zuniga wanted to rule in regards to Sy Ray. Who is Sy Ray? He is a new cell phone expert that Marlisa Ferreira wants to testify in regards to May 30, 2012. The Atwals and I believe Walter Wells were in the same SE Turlock cell tower and the SE sector of that cell tower. They were all in the same area, which includes Frank Carson property. The only problem is that tower also covers Pop and Cork. Everybody has already admitted they were at Pop and Cork. So she wanted to bring this in. Judge Zuniga ruled that Hans Hjertonsson argument that no defense expert was called in their case, they didn’t talk about this issue, so it is not rebuttal. Marlisa Ferreira is trying to get in fresh information to rehabilitate Jim Cook. Judge Zuniga said previously she had denied this, Marlisa Ferreira wanted to do this in her case in chief, after Jim Cook imploded, and she denied it. Judge Zuniga said she stood back looking at the Jim Cook information and the things that have happened since he testified, especially since November when Marlisa Ferreira gave notice that she wanted to put up this new cell phone expert. Judge Zuniga said Marlisa Ferreira argument that she wants to rebut Patrick Emery’s testimony, she said if Jim Cook had not screwed things up so bad in the first place there would be no need for Sy Ray. Judge Zuniga went into a little commentary saying no one at the DA’s office stood back and looked at Jim Cook’s testimony and he was on the stand for 7 weeks in the preliminary hearing. It was not evaluated after that hearing because it was terrible, problematic and he was on the stand for 7 weeks. She did issue some holding orders, she did not hold on some other and Walter Wells decision was based on Jim Cook’s testimony and the information showed very little about Korey Kauffman. Jim Cook has caused all these problems for the DA’s office with what he did and the way he testified. He would not answer questions. He wanted to pretend he was attorney at times (I’m paraphrasing a bit). He would not answer the questions as posed (You heard my say CANAQAP!). It was an ongoing issue with him this time around also. Jim Cook, Judge Zuniga said, was not the expert they needed and should have never been used. Expert testimony is used to establish one way or another and he really didn’t do either. Jim Cook showed he did not have an engineering background. He testified that he was able to determine angles and overlaps with a protractor and eyeballing. That is not the expert they needed.
She didn’t say this, but I’m thinking, and yet they paid him $400,000 do it.
She says it is too late. She is not going to allow Sy Ray to testify.
In regard to Gary Harmer, Hans Hjertonsson said they do have a right to third party culpability. Marlisa Ferreira said third party culpability had been done. She objects to anyone else from the third party culpability angle. The Judge ruled that only Mike Cooley could be implicated in third party culpability, meaning the defense is allowed to point out that Mike Cooley could have killed Korey Kauffman.
The Judge said she has read all of Charlie O’Dell’s testimony and Mike Cooley’s testimony and the cross examination of Ronald Cooper and TJ Samara Singh. In regards to Mike Cooley’s violent nature, being jealous and other incidents that had occurred on Lander and other areas. During cross examination, Mike Cooley lost his temper with attorneys, especially Jai Gohel. There were cuts on the victims jacket, consistent with a knife. Mike Cooley was known for using a knife. The inferences were made that Mike Cooley committed the homicide.
When Charlie O’Dell testified about Mike Cooley and his trip to Sonora where he had picked them up in Escalon late at night, Cooley claimed he got rid of somebody that was messing with him.
What Marlisa Ferreira wants is Gary Harmer (he’s the DNA expert. He’s very knowledgeable) to testify that Mike Cooley’s DNA is not on the 22 caliber bullet found at the scene in Mariposa. None of the other defendants, Carson or the Athwal’s, their DNA is not on the bullet either. So that must mean they are all innocent. I don’t really understand what Marlisa Ferreira is trying to say here.
Jai Gohel also asked the Judge if the CODIS information. CODIS is the database were all convicted people have their DNA stored in the database. For some reason there was a full DNA profile on that bullet of an unknown source, but they never ran that DNA through CODIS to track down who that DNA was. It sounded like Judge Zuniga wasn’t going to allow that anyway, but the third party culpability information she will allow.
They talked about some of the Woody family Marlisa Ferreira wants to call, Brian Coates, Robert Branco, and Woodrow Woody (Robert Woody’s son). The argument made by Marlisa Ferreira that Robert Woody had made statements to each of those at the Woody house. Hans Hjertonsson is saying those witnesses, some of them weren’t even at the house during the time period, so those statements could not have been made. This is also to rebut Dr. Leo about what Robert Woody said in the interviews and the nature of those. Because Dr. Leo said he was echoing things said on the street, but Marlisa Ferreira is trying to say he told his family these things early on. The transcripts show Brian Coates interview was in February of 2014. They had just moved back to the residence and hadn’t been living there for some time, he was in Fresno. Hans Hjertonsson argued the interview with Kirk Bunch and Brian Coates are not consistent with Robert Woody’s dates and statements he made.
Marlisa Ferreira said Branco, Coates and Woodrow have all made statements prior to Robert Woody going into custody. She is saying these statements were made prior to any information coming in from the streets, so Woody must have first hand knowledge.
Hans Hjertonsson said Woodrow Woody made a statement shorty after Korey Kauffman went missing, but Brian Coates wasn’t there during the earlier dates and can’t testify except to a recording that he heard. Branco has testified that he was talking at Pop and Cork with Robert Woody and Daljit Athwal.
Judge Zuniga thought it was Woodrow Woody and not Branco. Marlisa Ferreira said Branco testified to Athwal statements and Judge Zuniga shut her down with a Robert Woody statement in the middle of that. Then they returned to 2014.
Apparently Branco had talked to Miranda Dykes and she had told him what she was told by Robert Woody during the body wire that she wore. They were getting some transcripts. They didn’t have the transcripts of those interviews so the DA’s office was getting those transcripts brought in. So that is to be determined.
Marlisa Ferreira said in regards to Paul Cassall, he is an expert that has been used in Federal Court many times in opposition to Dr. Leo. Judge Zuniga said that is not the point. The defense’s point is that they received late notice for an expert. She gave noticed, according to the defense, they got an email last Wednesday night. She sent an email saying they wanted to bring in this other expert Dr. Cassall. She provided no information or discovery. He’s not even the guy that was sitting in the courtroom when Dr. Leo was testifying. She talked about putting him on the stand and then said she wasn’t going to and that guy was no longer there. So something happened there, but of course she’s not going to fess up to that.
Marlisa Ferreira said they just discovered Cassall in Dr. Leo’s testimony when she read an article and saw something about Cassall on opposite sides of a federal case. Dr. Cassall was contacted and advised he was used in a federal court and Dr. Leo brought up Casall in an article and testimony. She said there has been no discovery provided yet, she will if she’s allowed. It sounded like to me she’s throwing a Hail Mary. He’s going to testify about the methods used by law enforcement and testified to by Dr. Leo.
Marlisa Ferreira also said Dr. Leo has never had a straight answer and wants to show what his methods are and said they are compromised. They are not valid methods. It will be a very limited, but important issue and again she referred to Dr. Leo and his work as “junk science”.
Hans Hjertonsson went into a narrative and talking about how Marlisa Ferreira said she could call Jim Cook, sometime back and he’s referencing other experts that has been called. Hans Hjertonsson said he gave her all the information in 2017 as a courtesy. There is also a Mr. Wong (in regards to holes in the jacket) but he was never called, but he gave her the information a long time ago. He gave her CV in a 47 page report all outlined with what Dr. Leo would testify to. He gave that over a year in advance. Marlisa Ferreira had that information and she could have researched it then and everything that she is talking about now could have been dealt with at that time. In limiting motions, Dr. Leo was allowed to testify as an expert and Marlisa Ferreira didn’t think about any type of rebuttal witness until last week.
They have to give notice a certain amount of time in advance, because there is research to be done.
He said they did receive on April 15, 2019 a CV resume of the expert that had been sitting in court for a couple of days. I forget his name. Just now she is saying it is a different expert than that one who will testify. Something happened with that other expert that was sitting in court observing Dr. Leo’s testimony. He’s gone now, but Dr. Cassall was thrown in via an email last Wednesday night. Hans Hjertonsson is saying that is not enough notice. Apparently Marlisa Ferreira had changed her mind and Attorney Hans said it shouldn’t be allowed. He cited case law and the DA must provide within a certain number of days information on the expert so they can rebut with another expert. Marlisa Ferreira should have provided this information long ago and is now trying to sandbag the defense.
Jai Gohel argued his case citations were on point. There was a clear intent by the defense to call experts. They were notified long before they needed to be. Under Supreme Court rulings and the penal code, Marlisa Ferreira gave them no notice whatsoever. Dr. Leo have a 47 page report and the only article noted in the testimony was a death penalty article and they aren’t sure if any other article that Marlisa Ferreira may be referring to. Marlisa Ferreira should have done her homework 16 – 18 months ago. There are also depositions that may need to be obtained. He said sandbagging is not allowed under the law and 20 day disclosure after other witness testimony is how it should be done. That is a Supreme Court ruling that has dictated that. This could have been prevented if Marlisa Ferreira simply did her homework. Lack of preparation by Marlisa Ferreira is a denial of due process if this expert is allowed to testify.
Marlisa Ferreira was bouncing in her seat a bit. She said she had six binders of information on Dr. Leo and was very prepared for his testimony. They weren’t prepared that Dr. Leo was being forthwith with information like he should have been. Some information wasn’t accurate or answered property. Interviews that are recorded relate to possible coercive tactics, but he testified to something different when he was on that stand. They had 402 hearings and such, but Dr. Leo flipped flopped at the last minute. Dr. Leo, despite prior stances of recordings and then changes his stance while on the stand. Dr. Leo is nothing more than a junk scientist and what he said on the stand is different than what he said other times. Dr. Leo also testified with Robert Woody’s defense attorneys were not supporting him was also not accurate. She have defense the intent to call, but will turn everything over if he is allowed to testify. She noted there is a federal case where Dr. Leo talked about Nicole Harris vs. Chicago PD or city and Paul Cassall had talked about testifying in that case, but actually didn’t and then had issues with what Dr. Leo had said. Then Marlisa Ferreira said something interesting. She said well we are spending all this time on this, this afternoon and there are other things we could have been doing. He may not be available anyway. He has a heavy schedule and vacations and so it sounds like she thinks she may not even get him anyways.
Hans Hjertonsson said Marlisa Ferreira is misrepresenting what Dr. Leo testified to. According to Hans Hjertonsson, she could have impeached him with prior testimony and articles and didn’t have to call another expert. The questioning decides to coerciveness of the questioning or not. Marlisa Ferreira said something unexpected came out from Dr. Leo and now she wants a rebuttal expert. Now she is saying Cassall is not going to be called anyway. It is a complicated process with experts and it takes time to research.
Jai Gohel said in regards to background and opinions of Dr. Leo, he is well known. In limine motions Dr. Leo was allowed to testify and Marlisa Ferreira is aware of his resume and past. In regards to Robert Woody, Marlisa Ferreira is jumping to last minute conclusions and trying to save her case.
Percy Martinez argued that experts are not typical witness and they have to prepare for them. This is a last minute Hurrah/hail Mary that Marlisa Ferreira is attempting. Then Percy Martinez says after all this arguing, now she’s saying she may not call him anyway because she doesn’t think she can get him.
Judge Zuniga said everyone has forgotten that the transcript went out to all and the information is available to the DA’s office. Marlisa Ferreira said she became aware of this when Dr. Leo was testifying, but she has reviewed the record and that is not part of it. Marlisa Ferreira had information a long time ago, but did not act on it. This is not an issue as far as she is concerned, it is for the jury to decide. Marlisa Ferreira was asked if that expert was going to be called and said she was thinking about someone else, talking about the expert in the courtroom monitoring Dr. Leo. Then late Wednesday night she gives notice. Judge Zuniga said it is too late. This case needs to finish. The defense claim they need to prepare and she referred to Hans Hjertonsson saying he has been very studious about preparing, especially cell phone evidence. Request to put on Paul Cassall was denied.
Marlisa Ferrier wanted an offer of proof on the two Limas and David McMillan’s wife, who were in the courtroom earlier.
Percy Martinez said the defense is going to show there were people at the scene right after the body was recovered. There were people from Turlock there at the scene. David McMillan was there one date and then the two Limas were there with David McMillan. The defense is saying the Turlock rumor mill had gotten to Robert Woody. They haven’t been able to locate David McMillan, but will call him if they can locate him, but they can verify it thru the two Limas and his ex-wife.
Judge Zuniga said Marlisa Ferreira’s objection is that there is no connection to Robert Woody. Percy Martinez said they are trying to show the connection to Robert Woody. They are also going to call a Deputy Moraz . There was a search warrant done at Mike Cooley’s property in 2014. He was taken into custody on knives and dealing drugs. Marlisa Ferreira said Mike Cooley had already admitted to that.
She also was complaining and starting to rant a little bit. She’s not happy, she kind of took it on the chin today. She said the note passed from Dr. Leo to Hans Hjertonsson has been promised to her, but hasn’t been turned over by Hans Hjertonsson. She asked for it then. He said he would give it to her, but he hasn’t. She was very loud and very aggressive. Marlisa Ferreira was yelling about Judge Zuniga chastising her for talking to her experts when they were on the stand, but Hans Hjertonsson was talking with Dr. Leo.
Judge Zuniga said that Marlisa Ferreira did ask for that note, but didn’t do any followup when Dr. Leo was on the stand. Judge Zuniga did order Hans Hjertonsson to turn over the note by tomorrow.
That was it for today. With these rulings today, it is looking a little brighter to actually be done by June 19, 2019. We are back tomorrow at 9 AM. Marlisa Ferreira did say she could have her case done by Tuesday, because we lost today. We are getting to the end. Frank Carson was there this morning, but not this afternoon. He was in good spirits, just tired.
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Back tomorrow at 9 AM. A few people in court today, but not enough. People really need to find out what is going on. Like I always say: Don’t take my word for it, come to court and find out for yourself. Goodnight everybody.
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